Interview with Tony
Tony is a 39-year-old psychologist. He had kinesiology sessions for food allergies and, more recently, for coping with the murder of a friend.
A: Tony, can you recall a kinesiology session please? Tell me a bit about how you experience muscle testing.
T: The last session that I had with P?
T: I knew, I was in shock about an emotional trauma, a murder, and I went to P for a different reason, but it was apparent that I needed to work on this, on the shock.
A: When you get tested, can you feel how the muscles get weak and strong?
T: Yes, it’s very clear. What I like about the muscle testing is that it really connects me. I’m not relying on the practitioner, but I feel the truth of my body’s response myself. It’s undeniable evidence for me and the skill of asking the questions is important. If the practitioner is good with the questions that they ask, I can feel my response and I feel the truth of what’s been said and it helps me to connect to a more understanding of myself. What I realised during the sessions is that I know what I need. I really do know it and the practitioner is just bringing it out, demonstrating it.
A: So, you think the muscle testing really shows what you know within yourself.
T: Yes, yes.
A: Is it accessing your inner knowing? What sense do you get from this procedure?
T: The sense of rightness of what comes out, because it is my knowingness. It connects me more to my knowingness and, in this case, it just confirms my knowingness because I knew I was in shock. It was emotional shock and I knew I was experiencing rage about what happened. I wasn’t letting myself feel it. I knew these things but somehow it confirmed it for me and let me connect my conscious mind more with what needed to happen at an emotional level.
A: What do you gain out of the muscle testing procedure? Why do you have to go to a practitioner if you know what is on line for you?
T: That was this particular case. There have been other cases where I haven’t known, particularly dietary. What I value about P is the dietary advice. But in the context of the last session, I’m already coming from a situation which is quite deep in emotional and energetic work. I understand a lot about emotional energy. So it was a confirmation of what I had already been working on in a group. That was, where my energy was. I needed to work with what was. It’s like, how can you talk about diet when someone has been murdered? I mean, it was bizarre.
So there are other cases where, particularly dietary, I didn’t have such a clear notion. I went through the candida diet with P and, after I’d been through the clean-out, I found that I connected much more with what I wanted to eat. Like my palate became much more refined. I started to know. Like, I’d take a bite of something and I knew I didn’t want to eat that. So even there, it started to refine me. The muscle testing was like the first step.
A: So would you say the muscle test has enhanced your perception of reality, what has happened to you in your physical body or... ?
T: Yeah, it has given me some guides to deeper awareness of what my truth is. What my real knowing is.
A: Can you go back to the feeling of lying and being tested? How do you feel about the muscle test as a procedure?
T: It’s fine.
A: Is it invasive?
T: No, no, it’s not invasive at all. I’m an acupuncturist, so looking at someone’s tongue, for example, is very invasive because a lot of people are embarrassed to show their tongue. Taking a pulse isn’t, but also palpation of the body is invasive. What I like about the kinesiology muscle testing is that it’s a very simple procedure. It’s not invasive at all. It doesn’t invade any boundaries that I may have. It involves me as well. I feel the truth, I’m not relying on some doctor. I don’t trust doctors.
I don’t trust people telling me what is wrong with me. I need to feel it myself and I get that through the muscle test. So I guess it’s invasive in the sense that it really does show me the truth of what the result is. I feel it, but it’s not invasive against any boundaries that I might have or any privacy that I might want to respect.
A: Do you feel the muscle test shows in any way only what you are able to be aware of at a particular point in time?
T: I don’t think that is a function of the muscle tests themselves. I think that the muscle test will show whatever the practitioner and the patient are capable of being aware of. It’s like any diagnostic procedure. And P is very sensitive in the use of muscle test. It goes to a deep level. For example, she tests spiritual things or chakras that are open or whatever. So I don’t feel that the muscle test is bound to a certain level of experience.
A: Right, so when you see a practitioner now applying the muscle testing procedure, how much would you say is due to the tool and what is the person?
T: I’d say it is one hundred percent the person. I don’t believe in a healing modality without persons. I don’t believe that there is a diagnostic tool that just gives you the right answer. It is the awareness and skill. I mean, what point is for the practitioner to have the most spiritual knowledge of somebody who is totally unaware of it. It won’t make sense to them. Why do they need to know that their heart chakra is blocked if they’re a truck driver and concerned about the ache in their back. It’s not relevant. It’s not what they need. It’s the same the other way round.
If the patient is very refined and the practitioner is worried about a very gross level of medical intervention but the patient is really needing something on the soul level... again, it’s the awareness of both parties and the tools. I mean, to me, feeling the pulse is the same as kinesiology. But the advantage of kinesiology for me is just that it gives the patient a feeling of what the response is rather than they relying on the practitioner. They feel it for themselves.
A: Yeah, exactly. Do you feel that this is educational when you can feel yourself what is going on? Would you say that muscle testing gives a bit of power back to the patient or...?
T: Let me retract from that a little bit. I believe what you say, but I also believe, at a subtle level, if I’m sitting with a pulse diagnosis somewhere the same thing can happen as well. This is a gross level of indication back and for certain patients, this is good. They need to feel “Oh it’s weak”. But other patients can just feel their being, they can feel the truth for themselves and so the words of me as a practitioner don’t need to spell it out so much. They feel it for themselves. So again, a tool is a tool. It’s the person using the tool that makes the difference.
A: How do you experience muscle testing for yourself?
T: It’s a communication with myself mediated by the practitioner. What I like is that I come away with a sense of knowingness. A lot of practitioners just want to tell me what’s wrong with me and I don’t really want to accept this. I need to feel what’s wrong with me. I want to bring my awareness to that so that I’m responsible. I think this is easily mediated by the muscle test. I mean, I have other problems with kinesiology. I think that their intervention methods are lousy but it is a fantastic diagnostic tool.
A: So what do you think are the limits of kinesiology?
T: I think it’s a diagnostic tool. The muscle test is diagnostic but when you’re actually strengthening the points this to me is a little superficial and it’s very dependent. I mean, it could still be strong but it’s very dependent on the connectedness of the practitioner. I mean, with a really refined practitioner they could do good things with this as they could with anything. But there is something a little superficial to it, like talking about affirmations. I don’t like affirmations.
We talked about hypnosis and things. I don’t like using mental recitation to change my state. To me, it’s best to let the mind go completely and move into the heart energy or spiritual energy. Actually strengthening the points is fairly superficial compared to acupuncture.
A: You get a strong muscle response after such a point is strengthened. What do you feel about the result of the muscle test in that regard?
T: It’s easy to momentarily influence somebody’s energy. The muscle testing is showing the state of the energy and it’s easy to manipulate this superficial flow. But, you see, this superficial flow changes all the time, every minute. You look at something, you have a beautiful thought, it changes. So what the goal is to use this superficial energy to effect deep change, and this strengthening, weakening meridians is just superficial.
A: So, would you say the muscle test is a diagnostic tool, not such a superficial ever changing thing?
T: No, no. I think it’s a deeper diagnostic tool, but the actual interventions that are based on this I think are superficial.
A: Thank you for the interview.
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